Big Brother is watching…

[Courageous]

Personally I do not like the idea they can get file info from my hard drive.

Then don't let them.

The company that you loved from so long ago, died a while back. Didn't you notice? "He's dead, Jim".

C//

 

[marvin3634]

I agree I hate cheaters but you have a game they are going to exist. Bust the ones you find and go on with it. But to get anal about a game .. Dude that is seriously a therapy issue that really needs to be curbed fast .... Make the game for the staff and not the players then you get a company with a lot of employees but no customers. Relax a little !!!! ITS JUST A GAME... Besides every time EA tries to get stricter they run a large pay player base off, as you will see with this move to punkbusters. If I get a flag from my antispyware ...I will not install the program.And Believe me IT HAS already been flagged as spyware by most of the top brand scanners.

 

[Leipuri]

Sound like they are trying really hard to kill official servers. Plenty of players wount put up with that kind license.

 

[Damascus]

Is razor going to be tampored with?

Why the hell should they put punkbuster on uo? If some ass hole is using speed hacks there are already numerous custom built programs to detect and disable them. Someone needs to tell EA to F off. Especially on the razor issue, ik of a few players whom have a condition or permenant injury to the hands that have to use razor to play efficiently. And from my understanding of the issue, punkbuster is going to tampor with razor correct?

 

[Rift]

honestly sounds like there just wanting to create longterm problems for players and short term distraction for third party apps :-( protection routines and monitor rountines are all still workaroundable for third party apps....... even the punk software they planning on adding been bypassed from what I read around net only sad thing it literally might hurt some really good programs that not in development anymore........razor I have faith in its activly developed sure they figure something besides most ppl use it on runuo shards and seems like the plans of punk free shard being a testcenter must mean that the client going have to have something to read or send to server to send something to let let the punk software know to allow or disallow
monitor or not...... though i'll be sure to have any unknown outgoing address flagged and packet dump of data cuz really like to know whats headin out my computer from it lol but thats me I can be little paranoid sometimes lol

 

[WarAngel]

Great News.

Fuck Cheaters.

I Hope To God We Can Block Easyuo For Life.

:lol: Every time I read a post you make, I love you more. Can I have your babies or something?

 

[WarAngel]

well now, that link that you provided is just retarded. i don't see how ANYONE business or not can get away with that crap! i thought your ip address was like your computers social security number. omg the more i read about this, punk buster, the more i get upset with ea and thank them for making me quit! i really am upset because i am not even sure if this is LEGAL! i will however search and search and see if somewhere there is a law that nulls this, then i will post what i find out. there has to be something that says any business or software or program can not post for the public this information. it is not life threatening nor will it change anything about your life. i know states have sex offenders and child molesters on the net so you can search that. but a game cheater?! BIG DEAL! they are too stupid to play the game normally without cheating, just ban them and be done with it. (sorry to those who may read this and fall under this category just dont take offense). i really do think that there is a law to make it so they cannot post. but i hope runuo can find out more about this, because i sure cant. i am studying to be a paralegal so i will search the leagal end of this. oooooooooh ea makes me so mad!

How is it not legal? You sign an agreement to play the game. If you sign an agreement that says, "PunkBuster can make sure I'm not running cheat programs, and can display my name and my IP address if I am caught," then it is your own fault for cheating.

*NOTE: By sign an agreement, I mean agree to the EULA or TOS.

 

[WarAngel]

Why the hell should they put punkbuster on uo? If some ass hole is using speed hacks there are already numerous custom built programs to detect and disable them. Someone needs to tell EA to F off. Especially on the razor issue, ik of a few players whom have a condition or permenant injury to the hands that have to use razor to play efficiently. And from my understanding of the issue, punkbuster is going to tampor with razor correct?

They HAVE to use Razor to play efficiently? No offense, but that sounds like a load of bullshit. If you aren't able to click your mouse or perform the SIMPLE actions the default client requires to play efficiently, how are you able to use Razor? It still requires you to push buttons and do a lot of the things the default client requires. You just have the ability to push buttons more often and click things less often, but are the actions of clicking and pushing really that much different on a keyboard and mouse?

 

[Zippy]

They HAVE to use Razor to play efficiently? No offense, but that sounds like a load of bullshit. If you aren't able to click your mouse or perform the SIMPLE actions the default client requires to play efficiently, how are you able to use Razor? It still requires you to push buttons and do a lot of the things the default client requires. You just have the ability to push buttons more often and click things less often, but are the actions of clicking and pushing really that much different on a keyboard and mouse?

But this is the mindset that the UO developers have had for quite a long time.

UO was originally intended to be a pay per minute or pay per hour system, so it was specifically designed to be as addictive as possible and specifically designed to get you to play it for long periods of time. But UO isn't (and never was) on that kind of pay system. So the problem is doing anything requires a ton of mondaine and stupid tasks. Consider how long it takes to macro evaluate intelligence. Think aboput how nessessary that is for a mage character but how incredibly boring it is to macro it. It serves no real purpose other than increasing energy, but the only way to raise it is to target a mobile (actually with UO's anti-macro code, a LOT of mobiles) and read the stupid text above their heads. Its crazy and stupid shit like this that you cannot seriously blame anyone for doing.

Think about it.

 

[WarAngel]

But this is the mindset that the UO developers have had for quite a long time.

UO was originally intended to be a pay per minute or pay per hour system, so it was specifically designed to be as addictive as possible and specifically designed to get you to play it for long periods of time. But UO isn't (and never was) on that kind of pay system. So the problem is doing anything requires a ton of mondaine and stupid tasks. Consider how long it takes to macro evaluate intelligence. Think aboput how nessessary that is for a mage character but how incredibly boring it is to macro it. It serves no real purpose other than increasing energy, but the only way to raise it is to target a mobile (actually with UO's anti-macro code, a LOT of mobiles) and read the stupid text above their heads. Its crazy and stupid shit like this that you cannot seriously blame anyone for doing.

Think about it.

Oh, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with macroing or anything like that. I do it all the time. I'm just saying that using an excuse like, "I have a disease in my hand so I HAVE to use Razor," is pretty lame in this situation, or any situation. If you're going to use Razor, be proud about it. Don't hide behind lame excuses.

 

[Zippy]

Oh, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with macroing or anything like that. I do it all the time. I'm just saying that using an excuse like, "I have a disease in my hand so I HAVE to use Razor," is pretty lame in this situation, or any situation. If you're going to use Razor, be proud about it. Don't hide behind lame excuses.

My point was that the crippling dullness of certain tasks makes it so you have to use Razor.

 

[drakeypooh1]

I hate UO hacking but if this PunkBuster really does collect private info, I am never patching with OSI again...

There's no point in it anyway. In two weeks a hack will exist for the PunkBuster.

 

[dkor]

ok i didnt go thru and read all of this but i read the first one and the last few . afaik PB will be able to be gone around b4 its out(or if it is already its already been haxxored) and afaik it is an optional thing to install b/c they have servers that dont need it(open bnet anyone? lol) And in no way would it collect any personal info b/c that it wont even work with UO freeshards b/c the GM's have to activate it. this is all the rumors that ive heard of and i have this feeling that they are all true if its all been said b4 well my bad just my 2 cents
-Danny

 

[Kamuflaro]

ok i didnt go thru and read all of this but i read the first one and the last few . afaik PB will be able to be gone around b4 its out(or if it is already its already been haxxored) and afaik it is an optional thing to install b/c they have servers that dont need it(open bnet anyone? lol) And in no way would it collect any personal info b/c that it wont even work with UO freeshards b/c the GM's have to activate it. this is all the rumors that ive heard of and i have this feeling that they are all true if its all been said b4 well my bad just my 2 cents
-Danny

I would call "whatever it takes to identify my computer by it's unique hardware ID" personal information and that is what PB gets at least.

 

[Courageous]

The belief that we have a "right to be anonymous" is a curious phenomenon of the late 20th and early 21st century. There are both good things and bad things about anonymity. Good: being able to express and publish political opinions without fear of consequence. Bad: electronic crimes, extreme social misbehavior online without fear of consequence. It's interesting to watch the social and political forces align. Round and round it goes, where it stops, nobody knows.

C//

 

[flitwick]

I'm surprised to see how many people dislike EasyUO. Over the years, I've created and built up dozens of characters on various shards. Quite frankly, the process is tedious and boring. Without EasyUO, I don't think I'd ever be willing to "start over" on a new shard. I'm sure most players would agree that after building every skill in the game from 0 to 100+ 3 or 4 times, the process gets repetitive Carpal Tunnel anyone?

 

[Atomic]

What you guys miss is that the point behind UO is not to create a bunch of 5xGM chars on a bunch of shards.. the point is to get a char that you like and see it evolve slowly and get stronger.. But yeah, osi missed that point long ago and this is not going to fix it.

 

[RunUO2874]

But this is the mindset that the UO developers have had for quite a long time.

UO was originally intended to be a pay per minute or pay per hour system, so it was specifically designed to be as addictive as possible and specifically designed to get you to play it for long periods of time. But UO isn't (and never was) on that kind of pay system. So the problem is doing anything requires a ton of mondaine and stupid tasks. Consider how long it takes to macro evaluate intelligence. Think aboput how nessessary that is for a mage character but how incredibly boring it is to macro it. It serves no real purpose other than increasing energy, but the only way to raise it is to target a mobile (actually with UO's anti-macro code, a LOT of mobiles) and read the stupid text above their heads. Its crazy and stupid shit like this that you cannot seriously blame anyone for doing.

Think about it.

Curiously, though, we own RunUO. Its only like this because thats how we (or rather, you) made it. I don't see any reason why we can't change it to a system that makes unatended macroing pointless.

 

[Slayer706]

Really theres nothing RunUO will have to worry about. In order for PunkBuster to do all these things, you will have to agree to their TOS. If you don't hit the "I agree" button, it will not install. Also like someone else said, EA is having a non-PunkBuster server. That means if you don't have to install it to play an official server, you won't have to have it installed to use the client itself.
Also for all the privacy freaks, PunkBuster's license agreement specifically states (an entire paragraph devoted to this one point) that everything it does is done to stop cheat programs and software. That means if they take your personal information and do something with it not involving cheat detection, they are in breach of their own contract and you can sue them for the big bucks. By stating that they can look at your harddrive and take screenshots, does not mean they can use the information for anything else besides what they stated in the agreement. Also note that there aren't employees scanning harddrives, its a machine that does the scans. Machines can't read, it will scan for cheats and then send a report to whoever requested the scan with a few system specifications and whether it found cheats or not.
As for the global bans, PunkBuster has stated that they will not handle the bans. On official servers, if a cheat is detected on your system it will alert a GM who will take the apropriate actions.
But if you only play RunUO you don't have to worry about any of this since as long as you dont hit the "I agree" button on their terms of service, they can't do anything. And as I said, I doubt you will have to have PunkBuster active to use the client since there will be non-PunkBuster servers.

Whew.... Anymore questions? Hehe.

 

[LessZoa]

I'm one of those voices over there on the Stratics forums talking about PB.

1-PB will not scan your whole hard drive says EA & EB.. bit it has the potential to.
2-PB is not compatible with many kernal-protecting programs.
3-PB is not compatible with some anti-virus software packages.
4-PB requires the active user to have Admin status on the PC.

According to PB's own documentation, it looks for "altered game files" and if they are detected, the player is booted from the server, given a message, and cannot log back in until the situation is rectified. This is the procedure in the FPS games. Try that one time while in a champ. body decay, robbed, loss of major artifacts.

Of course, PB will have to be altered to accommodate this. But here is my question...

Why doesn't EA code it themselves?!?! Why get a thrid party involved?!? The learning curve, matching of code, testing, debugging.... sorry. I don't see how this is a wise choice by whomever is running the show there at EA.


These are the issues many of us have concerns with. Not only is the TOS from EB rather unpaletable to those of us who are security minded, but the fact that we have to A) disable our deep level security programs and B) Allow administrative rights to all users. This bothers me. This bothers a lot of other people.

Imagine your son or daughter with admin rights on your machine.
That in itself is a very scary thought.


Imagine someone cracking into your system because you had to disable your security software. That crack then notices you running PB... waalaa! A few simple lines of code and that crack has PB scanning your entire harddrive... then moves to the rest of the computers on your LAN (if you have one).

Yes... PB can do that.

How many people play UO at work (business owners and techno-geeks like me)? How many small business owners work from their home office? Does your kid or spouse play UO even if you don't?? Are they sharing the same cable connection or DSL line?

hmmmmm.....


Not that EB or EA would admit this themselves... but the software they are pushing down the Pay-Shard Player's throat does have that potential.


After almost 10 years.... looks like I will leave the Pay Shards. Just wish it wasn't like this.